Subject: [Jason Quigley <[email-masked]>] Re: Mac OS X and netatalk...

From: Matthew Keller <[email-masked]>
Date: 06 Apr 2001 10:03:50 -0400

For those of you interested in a case study on immaturity. What's a
"kill file"? Is that like one of those lists people make to sound big
and tough and list off everyone they'd like to erase from the planet?
*chuckle* Oh I'm on a lot of those- Not since I was in High School,
however.

-----Forwarded Message-----
From: Jason Quigley <[email-masked]>
To: Matthew Keller <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Mac OS X and netatalk...

What do you think "general impression that *I* get" means?

When I talked about people not having a clue, I was commenting on the 
fact that sometimes the problem is on the server side, other times it's 
on the client side and with both sides changing so rapidly these days... 
Also, I wasn't only referring to the developers. I wholeheartedly admit 
that I don't have a clue what's going on either!

 From what I have seen, most of the "jocks" (which is used in a 
complementary form as one would with good pilots - you're a nerd, aren't 
you, which is why I guess you read it that way) do lean quite a bit 
towards Linux. I never suggested that any platform was ignored.

When you use comments such as "many of your ilk" you are also casting 
aspersions. Listen to your own preaching.

I understand what PRE means. There never has been a release version, 
though, so don't get uppity with me, especially since I don't see too 
many contributions from you either.

You're in my kill file. Try and get a life you dweeb.

Mr. Quigley (That's Sir to you)

On Friday, April 6, 2001, at 05:57  am, Matthew Keller wrote:

> At 1:23 Uhr +0200 04.04.2001, QUIGLEY,JASON (HP-Spain,ex1 wrote:
>> I think the general impression that I get is that nobody really has a
>> clue what's at fault and as the jocks on source forge don't really
>> care too much about anything other Linux, those of us who like to
>> run stable setups are in for a long wait for a resolution.
>
> Mr Quigley,
>
> Perhaps you'd like to volunteer to help submit bugfixes. I don't see any
> contributions by you at all, yet you have the gall to accuse the "jocks
> on sourceforge" of anything? The "jocks on sourceforge" use whichever
> machines they have and know. We've got people using Solaris, FreeBSD,
> and Linux on 4 architectures that I know of working on the code- Some
> people are working on MacOSX, HPUX and other platforms too. Instead of
> contributing to the FUD and poo hooing those who are working to make
> this product better, perhaps you can contribute. Don't give me any of
> this "I've submitted patches but they all get rejected" like many of
> your ilk do - Because I can verify that your name has not come up on a
> single line of submitted code.
>
> I hate politics. More than hating politics I hate people who have
> platform zealousy issues. If you feel that whichever platform you're
> using is under-represented among the "jocks on sourceforge", perhaps you
> could bring yourself down to our/their level and contribute. Not a
> single "jock on sourceforge" has any grudge against any platform - Sure,
> we all have preferences - But to insinuate that we/they intentionally
> ignore or "code against" a certain platform is beyond ludicrous- Not too
> mention rude.
>
> Furthermore, perhaps you noticed a certain three (3) letters in the
> names of the releases that the "jocks on sourceforge" have made. "PRE".
> "PRE" means "THIS FUCKING SHIT ISN'T SUPPOSED TO WORK YET BECAUSE WE'RE
> STILL DEVELOPING IT SO IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING ***CONSTRUCTIVE*** TO
> SAY OR CODE TO CONTRIBUTE BACK THE FUCK OFF". *straightening jacket* The
> code coming out of the **PRE** 1.5 tree is considered alpha quality at
> best - Somedays a good Beta quality.
>
> We all have wishlists. We all would like Netatalk to be *the* AppleShare
> server on ALL *IXish machines. We would like to have a lot of success,
> meet 100% of peoples feature requests, and in general have a fun time
> doing it - And it's getting there. Slowly.
>
> So, Mr. Quigley, although your views and opinions are welcome - I'll be
> the last person to suppress that - I think you should get your facts in
> line before making inflammatory statements about the people who are
> trying to make a product you *CONSUME* as good as it can be- People,
> mind you, who aren't getting paid for this. People who do it so that
> they can actually CONTRIBUTE to something, instead of COMPLAINING about
> it. Inflammatory, derogatory statements like yours only hurts production
> as it disheartens those who work hard on this project. If you aren't a
> coder - That's cool - Can you write docs? Maybe English isn't your first
> language so you could translate them into other languages? Perhaps you
> could use a debugger and send on debugging symbols to make the
> bug-hunters lives a little easier? Hell, we could all probably use
> bigger harddrives, more RAM, a couple days of "pay" to take time off
> from our busy lives and spend the day coding and bug-hunting, maybe an
> OS X server to give us something to test on. There's a LOT of ways you
> can help- And you've already found one grevious way to hurt.
>
> --
>
> Matthew Keller
> Enterprise System Analyst
> Computing & Technology Services
> Information Services Division
> State University of NY at Potsdam
>
> http://mattwork.potsdam.edu/
>

-- 

Matthew Keller
Enterprise System Analyst
Computing & Technology Services
Information Services Division
State University of NY at Potsdam

http://mattwork.potsdam.edu/

---

From: jeff <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 10:38:54 -0400

I'm honestly not sure what just went on, because I have a feeling that I
missed a few postings, due to upgrading my sendmail yesterday.

I would like to state, for the record, that netatalk was not, and will
not be, a Linux-centric application. I happen to package netatalk for
Linux, as it is the platform that I have the most access to at work and
at home. I believe I speak for the entire project when I say that any
compiled versions are very welcome, and all efforts will be made to make
sure that netatalk builds and runs on as many *BSD/*NIX platforms as
possible.

If there has been a lack of attention towards a certain problem that has
been posted up on sourceforge, please bring it to either Matthew's
attention or mine. You can email either of us without blasting the
project to a mailing list, no matter how frustrating everything has
been. I spent a good three weeks trying to iron out the DHX
authentication problem, during which I managed to keep my anger off of
the list. But just barely. :)

I understand both sides of this argument (from what little I've read),
and would ask the following:

*) If you have a problem with something not being supported, either
submit a patch for it, or email the development list about it. Someone
should respond to you. If in a week or two no one has responded, mail
either Matt or I.

*) If there are platform issues, please make them known. I would like to
see netatalk supporting all major *BSD/*NIX platforms by the 1.5 final
release.

I'd also like to take the time to explain that the pre-releases are
released whenever I seem to think that development has produced
something stable. I have been known to be very wrong about this, but I'm
simply trying to provide something for the community to use and test in
the time leading up to 1.5, which will hopefully be rock-solid.

If anyone has any comments on this, feel free to email me.

Thanks,
jeff

---

From: Magnus Stenman <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2001 18:42:44 +0200

It's the file which contains all the addresses of people
whose mail gets sorted into the /dev/null mail folder
automatically.

A good way of getting into kill files is to crosspost
off-topic messages... :-)

(and answering them)

/m